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Birth of a Writers Group

  • Nov. 2nd, 2008 at 12:28 PM
hooded eyes

J.R.R. "Tollers" Tolkien and C.S. "Jack" Lewis used to hang out with their literary buddies every Thursday night in Lewis' dorm room. They had no rules for these meetings, no officers, agendas or formal elections, but they did have a name, The Inklings. And what did they do? They sat around listening to first drafts of The Lord of the Rings or Out of the Silent Planet. They read, critiqued and discussed one another's unfinished works. If they were in a particularly silly mood they held competitions to see who could read the famously bad prose of Amanda McKittrick Ros for the longest without laughing (This probably ended with beer coming out their noses. Who knows?).  On Tuesdays they gathered again at the pub known as The Bird and Baby. They were friends, they were fledgling writers, and they grew their literary pen-feathers together. Most of them eventually flew off to become renowned writers of their time and ours. 

 

Virginia Wolf had the controversial Bloomsbury Group full of nonconformist writers, thinkers and artists. Most of its members lived in the West Coast 1 district of London known as Bloomsbury, thus the name. Together this group of elite intellectuals battled, loved and created around such issues as women's suffrage, war, politics, gender and aesthetics.  The group was shattered with the onslaught of the First World War but later, in their forties, most of them came back together as the Memoir Club which met irregularly for almost thirty years. There influence as an artistic community on the world as we know it can only be described as significant.

 

Stephen King and Dave Barry have a band. It's somewhat of a joke band, really, named the Rock Bottom Remainders. The members aren't primarily musicians, they're writers and they claim to play as well as Metallica writes novels. The point is they get together. They have fun and talk about their writing between songs. They have gone out of their way to create artistic community because, as much as we writers would like to deny it, good art is not created in a vacuum (or any other appliance for that matter). 

 

And what should happen on October 27, 2008 but the birth of another such community. I had the privilege of attending the virtual birth, of the Wily Writers Group, started by angelmcc and myself. Angel gets most of the credit. She did the labor. I wandered the halls looking confused but thrilled with a cup of coffee in hand. I cheered her on and couldn't wait to get my hands on the baby. 

 

We don't know what it will be quite yet, what it will grow into. What we do know is that we all want to "get serious" about writing. We want to improve our craft and sell enough to at least pay the light bill so we can see to write more. Maybe we'll grow famous alongside one another.  Maybe we'll only laugh and snort beer out our noses. 

 

Twelve speculative fiction writers from all over the globe have agreed to meet. Watch out universe, here we come. 


Questions for you LJ's out there:
Do you belong to a writers group or community?
If so, what size and how is it organized?  Is it face-to-face?  On the net?  Through LJ?
What is the most valuable thing to you about that group?
What would you change if you could to improve it?




 

Comments

( 9 comments — Leave a comment )
[info]alaneer wrote:
Nov. 2nd, 2008 01:50 am (UTC)
How wonderful. Congrats on forming a writers group. I should do that one of these days.
[info]xjenavivex wrote:
Nov. 2nd, 2008 03:55 pm (UTC)
have fun!
[info]zunzster wrote:
Nov. 3rd, 2008 08:42 am (UTC)
Congratulations, Ripley.

Colour me envious (which is an attractive shade of green if you're asking)

Everyone on Kiwi Writers seems to be somewhere other than Auckland :-(
[info]zunzster wrote:
Nov. 3rd, 2008 09:22 am (UTC)
Groups
Bad form to reply to myself I know...

But reading your questions a little more closely, I've spent many a year in groups of various kinds and trained in group dynamics work.

This was mainly under the rubric of counselling and support groups, but as anyone will tell you, groups are groups.

Bottom line: In all my experience of groups, ultimately what determines whether a group thrives or not is how it handles conflict. And avoiding it counts as a way of handling it that eventually sucks the vitality from the group.

When groups start, the initial warmth and sense of connection makes conflict and disagreement seem like very distant concerns. This is a very normal stage of group process. It really helps to talk about how you'll handle conflict constructively before it happens.

Anyway, I could ramble on about this for ages. Brevity does not appear to me one of my strengths

In my training, I found Bruce Tuckman had a very accessable group process summary - it's arguably somewhat dated now and he overdid the cute names but anyway, a quick bit of googling produced the following:

http://www.chimaeraconsulting.com/tuckman.htm

I have an academic paper on virtual work groups from my Management paper which might be useful if you're interested.

Virtual groups suffer some unique challenges that pull them apart as well as some unique opportunities than pull them together. It's the balance of these forces that determine what works and stays together.

My apologies if this comes across as all very theoretical and academic.

But your questions are important ones and I can see you really want to take your writing seriously with this group, and I think that means taking the group (and it's process) seriously too.
[info]rippatton wrote:
Nov. 4th, 2008 03:37 am (UTC)
Re: Groups
Zunster,
Thanks for all the "group" thought. I too have quite a bit of past experience leading face-to-face groups (though not writerly ones) and have been tutored in their dynamics.

The one face-to-face writers group I did attend fell apart quickly for two reasons I think - lack of committment to writing by the members and a complete unwillingness to say anything negative (and thus constructive)about anyone else's work.

Do you consider critique to be conflict? If so, does that honing, or sharpening of one another against stone grow a group into cohesion?
(Anonymous) wrote:
Nov. 4th, 2008 04:38 am (UTC)
Re: Groups
I must say it doesn't surprise me to learn that you'd had a fair chunk of group experience under your belt. Maybe there is a groups equivalent of gay-dar :-)

In fact, given your mythic bent, I had been wondering if you had a passion for Campbell and Jung - my favourite quote being "mythology is psychology misinterpreted as history"

Your first face-to-face group sounds like a classic example of a group dying still-born in what Tuckman calls the Forming stage.

Lack of commitment and lack of conflict actually speak to same initial underlying fear - the inclusion/exclusion crisis. This term is actually from a different model of group dynamics - I can't remember which one offhand, I think it might be Existentialist.

And yes, critique is MOST definitely a form of conflict.

I've recently joined the Critters group, mainly due to your recommendation actually.

I was reading their many pages of advice on how to and how not to critique.

And once I'd waded through it all, it reminded me very strongly of the 'ground rules' we used in the men's support group that I was part of for many years, (initially as a particpant and later as a facillitator).

Only since we were dealing with ordinary guys and not writers in a drop-in format, we had to break it down to 4 really simple rules which we could write up on the white-board each session.

Use 'I' statements - own your opinions
Express your feelings - sad/glad/bad/mad
Should is shit - no-one can tell anyone else what to do
Respect yourself and others - no violence, verbal or otherwise

And being a support group, there was always also rule 0 - Confidentiality - what you hear here, stays here.

I wonder if I should critique Critters critiquing guidelines and suggest aburt simplifies them. They are a bit intimidating and overwhelming initially :-)


[info]zunzster wrote:
Nov. 4th, 2008 05:00 am (UTC)
Re: Groups
That previous comment was from me (which I suppose it fairly obvious).

I just mucked up my login to LiveJournal initally.

And to answer your final question - does conflict handled well hone the group.

ABSOLUTELY! That's how _real_ intimacy is developed, and it's the only way.

Not just be playing 'nice' with each other - that's only partial intimacy - but by being honest and authentic with each other and ultimately helping to heal each others wounded inner child.

It's easy to stay put when you like what's being said about every one. The real test of any group is how you handle things when what's being said is painful.

Marriages are groups too :-)
[info]rippatton wrote:
Nov. 4th, 2008 05:33 am (UTC)
Re: Groups
Zunster,
Love Campbell though somehow missed him in early life, so am rather a Campbell newby- read all of his books my library has.

That writers group was definetly still-born. It was my first all-woman small group which has since led me to wonder what impact gender had. I felt like everyone just wanted to be "friendly" and have everyone like them. I wanted to grow as a writer. Then again, I was raised by a small group of boys:)

I love your group rules- especially "should is shit" Great!

I know what you mean about Aburts critter list. I personally think he goes a bit overboard to cushion the conflict factor but I'm sure he's had to deal with some doozies.

So glad I could turn you onto Critters. Actually this smaller group has birthed primarily out of assoications made through Critters over the years. If you hang around, and give as good aa you get, you begin to make some wonderful connections.
[info]zunzster wrote:
Nov. 4th, 2008 08:41 am (UTC)
Re: Groups
If you like Campbell, you'll probably dig Jungian work since that was a major inspiration source for Campbell.

I'd recommend 'What Jung Really Said' by E.A. Bennet.

I see Amazon's got it, but it's not cheap new but there are some used copies available which might to international shipping.

If you love Myth and it's relevance to deep psychology, Jung is the mother lode.

When I write horror, the Jungian concept of the shadow permeates everything I do, whether I want it to or not, because that's what your personal shadow does :-)

As to groups - I have been in many mixed groups (with Youthline) and in many all-male groups and the dynamics have some distinct differences. Oh, sure - the core process is the same, but the flavour and seasonings are quite remarkable. I love both for different reasons.

I can't speak about all women groups :-)

Hrmm.. there's a joke or two (and probably a story!) in there but I'm not going to go there.

I don't think you can take gender out of groups. Men and women communicate differently. I'm personally fond of Deborah Tannen's work on genderlects i.e. men and women both speak english (or whatever) but in their own dialect along with shared and implicit subcultural assumptions.

Interesting that you were raised by a group of boys. My father died when I was young, so I was raised by my mother and a group of women. I guess I can move between both worlds a little easier because of that - but the road was very bumpy :-(

My wife grew up with two brothers and also shares more traits with her rather than her mother, which is probably why we can relate in the middle across the gender divide.

Groups where everyone stays 'nice' are ultimately unsatisfactory IF you're looking for growth. And that's a big IF. Growth is scary. Growth is painful. But you won't get any being 'nice'.

My experience is that many people SAY they want to grow, but are quite conflicted about it internally.

And 'Should is shit' was always my favourite rule. To be honest, we did't actually phrase it that way. But I would have if I'd been given the chance.

Yeah, I think aburt goes overboard - but then he's a rescuer with good intentions. I recognise an earlier version of myself in his demeanour so I can't help but like him for it :-)

I hope you're writing group gives you the growth you desire. I get the feeling you've earned it.
( 9 comments — Leave a comment )